To me, if the fashion, automobile, jewelery,Smart phones, Computer, MP3 etc industries are manufacturing their products in China and we gladly accept the prices that is sold for, i do not understand why most watch collectors and lovers have a problem with watches being manufactured in China as well.

Perhaps it has got to do with the “XXXXX Made” branding which was cleverly devised as a markering strategy for enormous mark-ups during the period when Quartz defeated mechanical watches. Today, many people see it as a status/luxury indicator of their watch and palce confidence of its quality in it. While this is true that the quality is perhaps superior than China’s, i still question whether the prices and the mark-ups are justifiable. Or swiss companies limiting production so as to further increase the prices; controlling supply and demand? Is it necessary and justifiable or is it all mere marketing by capitalist who wants to earn more and more and more?

We always love to bask in the cloud of ideology that watchmaking is an art and it is amazing to behold real timepiece. Sure, watchmaking is an art but dont you think that it is increasingly becoming a marketing tool to promote watch brands? Truth be told, watchmakers in large brands do not have much say in product design etc… it is often handled by the design teams, R&D and the marketing/branding. I believe there is a conflict of interest in this area except in the independents…

Anw, my point is if we find it acceptable to purchase expensive Nike shoes that are made in China or esteem Iphones that are also made in China, what is wrong with watches made in China or its components produced in China? At least Perpetual doesnt say its swiss made or replicate another brand… it says it uses chinese movements which i think it is being honest. And the price is perhaps more justifiable than those crazy expensive swiss watches who use ETA movements that are made in China too… haha..

That particular Seagull Tourbillon was purchased pre-owned, and for more than $1k even secondhand. I also know one other person, a man who also owns timepieces from brands as diverse as Panerai (including having owned Pre-V ones), Breguet, and even an Independent brand, who purchased one new Seagull Tourbillon within the last two years.

I say this all as a precursor to my comment that I agree that you get what you pay for up to a point, as there is always a premium to be paid for the “brand name”, amongst other things. That all being said, if I was to have the funds to get a tourbillon, despite the possibility that the Breguet tourbillon may not be the one that many see as the top range tourbillon in the world today, I am a sentimentalist about the brand and I’d probably opt for a Breguet. Would I get what I was paying for? I think so, because I would be paying for history, as well.

I would not buy a Seagull tourbillon, as for the money I’d get something else. However, there are people I have the utmost horological respect for, in terms of knowledge, who speak well of the brand that I can’t afford to dismiss them or the quality (for the price).

Also, I’d not call this watch a “genuine fake”. I don’t know of the brand, but if they use a Seagull movement then I’d probably just call them a Chinese tourbillon.

Is Perpetual a genuine stand alone brand? I can’t honestly say, but that seems to be their intent and their website looks a lot better than many “homage watch” websites!

I too have heard positive things about the Sea Gull movement, and whilst I’m not quite at the stage where I’d purchase one myself I do think they are on the right track.

And I’ve got to say, while I have not seen a seagull tourbillion in real life – I’ve heard overwhelmingly positive things and I’d say they are getting (if not a good deal) a fair price on what is still a complicated movement.

I think the growing sophistication and increasing quality control of Chinese movement makers can only be a good thing all round; making tourbillions far more accessible, and perhaps even making the European makers pick up their game (so to speak), and differentiate themselves further.

Firstly, to clarify this is not a fake movement as such. It is actually a Chinese made movement made by a company called Sea-Gull which was founded back in 1955 and has a pretty decent reputation for making good quality Chinese movements.

The goal of the post was not so much to discredit Perpetual’s watches but rather draw to the attention of readers that these watches are not to be confused with the superior quality Swiss or German Made pieces. I am certainly not suggesting that the site is holding out these watches to be anything other than a cheap alternative, but there is the risk that an inexperienced person will think they are getting a great deal on a high-quality, complicated movment.

In this regard I don’t think there are really any ethical issues in buying a watch like this, and certainly I think Perpetual is doing the right thing by not trying to mislead potential customers although a bit of prior knowledge is probably useful. More and more we are seeing better quality products coming out of China at very reasonable prices so don’t be surprised if you see more people wearing these sorts of watches in the future.

This is interesting. You are saying that the watch itself is not a fake but the movement is?

My brother got a $50 skeleton watch as part of his birthday present from his girlfriend this year. It too is not a fake (not trying to be any brand). It is hilariously good looking, obviously made of cheap materials but you can see the guts of the watch from quite far away. Always a lover of weird watches, my brother loves it.

Other than being a cheap watch, do you have any issues with this type of thing? Is it an unethical purchase in any way?

Ramsay